View topic - BR7's shoulder

[Pommah Profile]

Articles are saying Ben has a shoulder separation. This is not a dislocation. A separation involves the outer end of the collar bone, where it sockets into your shoulder blade, where it is held in place by 3 ligaments. It's called a separation even when it's just sprained, a stretching of the ligaments, all the way to when the ligaments are torn.

Type 1 - ligaments stretched (a sprain), needs a few weeks to recover at least. Danger is going back in with weakened ligaments which give way more radically when injured again; possible to be out for entire season, but should expect full recovery. Depends on how far ligaments got stretched while the collar bone was out of its socket.
Type 2 - at least one of ligaments torn. Not typically surgically repaired, you just live with it. Affects your motion and you can have some pain the rest of your life.
Type 3 - at least two of the ligaments torn. Also not typically surgically repaired. Affects your motion and you have pain the rest of your life.
Types 4-6 - like type 3 but so bad your need surgery to fix. I have no idea if you are ever the same, but my guess is not.

Key is to listen to what grade of separation it is. I got a type 3 from falling off a bike avoiding a pothole I didn't see in time, how I know this shit. If it's anything but a type 1 Ben is done for the season and possibly even his career. If a type 1 and even a minor one, he needs to be out several weeks at least because a repeat blow to weakened ligaments can tear them, far worse than just having a sprain. Only thing to do is rest it in a sling which weakens the arm needing more recovery time to strengthen back up.

It may not look bad but a separation happens when the impact is on the side and the clavicle has nowhere to go but out of the socket. Hurts like a mofo when it happens, why he just got up and left, not any drama on this one.

This is not trivial, folks.

[SoCal Stiller Profile]

FUCK!!!!!!!!

[Pommah Profile]

Now they are saying it's the other end of the collar bone that is sprained.

Still depends on the severity of the sprain to know how long he will be out. Overall, however, this is vastly better than the earlier (falsely, it appears) reports of a shoulder separation.

However, shoulders are very complicated joints all around, not something you want to mess with. It's got to be thoroughly healed. We likely won't really know for a few days because the soft tissue damage that occurs in an injury like this swells and makes the MRI hard to read.

[SoCal Stiller Profile]

Excuse me, I just came in to look for the poop shirt. Found it!

[PGHeaven Profile]

By now we all know that BR7 has a 1srt rib in a position to impinge his aorta. Can we make the playofs with Lefty? Please allow me to start the discussion on this

We have the Rats 2 times in the next 3 weeks. Please accept my apology on this - but - Byron will be injured and out for the season in one of those 2 games. This means that we must win one of those games to have a chance. This puts it on our defense. So it circles back to "where is Troy? Is he going to play this season or fucking what?

[relictele Profile]

I hadn't seen Leftwich in a while - none of us had - so I'd forgotten he has a windup longer than Jim Palmer's.

[Pommah Profile]

I actually thought Lefty looked pretty good after he got warmed up. Had a couple of passes dropped too. I don't think he had a "fragile" rep before the season ending injuries of the prior two years in pre-season, let's hope that was lightning striking twice. And I tell you what, I had forgotten about the arm strength - when was the last time Ben outthrew Wally (although that throw did not have enough arc on it)? If he could just learn a short throwing motion but at age 32 that ain't going to happen.

But this doesnt rest on Wally it rests on whether or not the rest of the team rises to the occasion. The Patriots went 11-5 with Matt Cassell (!!!) as QB because they refused to believe they were shit without Tom Brady. This team can make the playoffs with Byron or Batch if they have the desire. Because I doubt Ben will be back this season. His rib ligaments have to grow enough to re-attach, to prevent him from potentially DYING if it happens again on the playing field. No doctor is going to sign off on that, and even if they do, how tentative will Ben be knowing another big whack could rip his aorta? Just let it go that he'll be back this season. I watched Bradshaw try to come back without letting his elbow fully heal, he just hurt it again, costing him maybe another 2-3 years on his career. Those teams were good enough to have won a 5th SB in '83 or '84 with Brad under center. We don't want that to happen with BR7.

[PGHeaven Profile]

Yep - We should probably gear our thinking towards no BR7 for the remainder of the year. May I be the first to say that we should make a solid QB pick next draft. Not no fucking Brian LePieere whatever type dude, but a good big QB. 2nd round!

[trenches Profile]

Brian LePieere

To back your point... Huh? Who?

[Pommah Profile]

Drafting a QB in 4th or 5th round is typically done for backup/trade purposes. I can't think of a decent starting QB who didn't go first or maybe second round with exception of Brady. You draft a serviceable backup, get a couple of years and maybe a few starts out of him, then trade him to a team whose QB gets hurt. Matt Cassel - 7th round pick, gets packaged with a guy whose got 1 maybe 2 years left, goes for a 2nd round pickm perfect example of this strategy.

Lets see how Byron does. Charlie is 37. Ben's only 30 we don't need to blow a high round pick on another QB. If Byron can't cut it might be time to blow a 4th round on a backup QB. Can't be any more of a waste than our last few years' 4th rounders.

[SoCal Stiller Profile]

Drafting a QB in 4th or 5th round is typically done for backup/trade purposes. I can't think of a decent starting QB who didn't go first or maybe second round with exception of Brady. You draft a serviceable backup, get a couple of years and maybe a few starts out of him, then trade him to a team whose QB gets hurt. Matt Cassel - 7th round pick, gets packaged with a guy whose got 1 maybe 2 years left, goes for a 2nd round pickm perfect example of this strategy.

Lets see how Byron does. Charlie is 37. Ben's only 30 we don't need to blow a high round pick on another QB. If Byron can't cut it might be time to blow a 4th round on a backup QB. Can't be any more of a waste than our last few years' 4th rounders.

Sometimes you can find a young guy in which an inept team gives up on too soon and fits your system better. One example I can think of is Colt McCoy. I thought the Browns gave up way too soon on this guy. His team around him was shit and I thought he looked pretty good in the sample of games I saw. Too bad for him that the rest of his team blew.

[Pommah Profile]

SoCal, yeah that's an option. McCoy did okay against the Steelers. Probably some other guys like that too. Hell there's that other Browns QB who made the pro bowl one year and cut the next, before McCoy, can't remember his name.

[PGHeaven Profile]

Brian LePieere

To back your point... Huh? Who?

lol. Noone can accuse me of cutting and pasting ay? ahem, I meant Brian St Pierre. I reall think we need a good backup. My point is that Byron and Batch BOTH can NOT last more than a few games. Its that simple. And I think that BR7 is going to get hurt as well. Therefore, you have got to acquire a BIG QB. Someone capable of playing all year and winning games. If you can find this type deep in the draft fine. I too liked Colts moxy and ability. But he is one bell short of being rung for good

[PGHeaven Profile]

Brian LePieere

To back your point... Huh? Who?

lol. Noone can accuse me of cutting and pasting ay? ahem, I meant Brian St Pierre. I reall think we need a good backup. My point is that Byron and Batch BOTH can NOT last more than a few games. Its that simple. And I think that BR7 is going to get hurt as well. Therefore, you have got to acquire a BIG QB. Someone capable of playing all year and winning games. If you can find this type deep in the draft fine. I too liked Colts moxy and ability. But he is one bell short of being rung for good

And there you have it. Byron lasted all but one game. He is done and will sit in favor of Charlie. Charlie will then proceed to get hurt and Byron will have to limp grimace and stumble his way through the remainder of that game and then the spectre of rushing Ben back in the week after

[Pommah Profile]

PGH, Congratulations on the most accurate and timely prediction I think this board has every seen.

Likely Byron's last football game. Guy just gets hurt, all there is to it, I don't see anybody picking him up. It's too bad, the guy's a warrior, staying in the game with two busted ribs - compare that to the turd in Chicago. But Tomlin should have yanked him. He couldnt' make the throws, especially after that big hit in Q3. Gawd that musta f'n hurt.

I vote for bringing in Palko. Pittsburgh kid coming in off the street to save the hometown team. It's too good a story to pass up. Even though he will likely suck.

[PGHeaven Profile]

PGH, Congratulations on the most accurate and timely prediction I think this board has every seen.

Likely Byron's last football game. Guy just gets hurt, all there is to it, I don't see anybody picking him up. It's too bad, the guy's a warrior, staying in the game with two busted ribs - compare that to the turd in Chicago. But Tomlin should have yanked him. He couldnt' make the throws, especially after that big hit in Q3. Gawd that musta f'n hurt.

I vote for bringing in Palko. Pittsburgh kid coming in off the street to save the hometown team. It's too good a story to pass up. Even though he will likely suck.

Thanks for the props Pommah. I think Jerrod Johnson. Give him some time - young guy - great arm - good legs - good instincts and won't break the bank. He and Plax can buddy up.

[Pommah Profile]

So we might see some kid who barely make our taxi squad, throwing to our old washed-up cast off jailbird receiver before the season is out. What a year. Maybe the Jest will deal us Santonio, give us a reunion of our former #1 draft pick bad boy receivers.

Hope you're as right about Johnson as you were about Byron, PGH.

[PGHeaven Profile]

lol. Yeah, I hear you on Johnson Pommah. But you know what? Who cares at this point? (side note: I am watching the 49'ers rookie Colin Koepernick just completely vaporize the vaunted Bears defense) I am thinking it's Batch now and just having an extra body available for when Charlie gets planted and hurt. Might as well be a gun slinger athletic type that can avoid a face planting. Or how about this? If Jerrod bootlegs a TD I doubt he will break a rib if he does a self induced log roll. Jeesh

[PGHeaven Profile]

Almost forgot to comment on Plax! he is a REAL gun slinger Hey you know what? Lets see if Plax can do what Wallace cant do - know what I mean? He may just invigorate Wally to actually put forth some effort. At this point Wallace is the person who disgusts me more than anyone - except maybe Adams. Seriously - if Plax is contrite and willing then I am ready fr it. After all - Plax paid his debt to society - I am ready to forgive him and I say

BRING ON PLAX!!!!

[LenSherwood Profile]

I can't see how Ben R. is not out for the season. You get conflicting reports about shoulder, rib separation threatening a main artery etc. Holy shit fellas, this might not just be season ending, it might be career ending. We will get to see how good a coach Tomlin is. Without an elite quarterback, you have to coach your ass off. I hope we only have to see for the rest of the year and not for the rest of Tomlin's tenure...