View topic - Stop the thoughtless LeBeau sniping

[SteelThatDon'tRust Profile]

Amidst all the sniping at LeBeau, something seems to me to be missing in the discussion: how much of the defnesive collapse is on LeBeau's play calling and scheming and how much of it is on piss poor execution by the players? It's fine if Still Mill wants to keep giving LeBeau poor marks, lord knows Mill knows way, WAY more about football than I do, but when Mill continually ALSO gives various defensive players low marks, this needs raise the question of how much of this shit is really on LeBeau and how much is on piss poor play. I understand complaining about softee defensive schemes and the dreaded puss-like prevent, but why does Pitt's pass rush suck so bad? What the hell happened to Harrison and Woodley? Is LeBeau telling the D line and line backers to take it easy? Give me a break. And even on softee d back schemes, is LeBeau telling the d backs to take horrible angles, drop what should be interceptions, tackle without arms and flail around in no man's land (anyone else missing McFadden?)? I call BS. No way Dick got this retarded in just one off season. The defense just flat out overwhelmed opponents last year. Number one against the pass I recall. This is not an invite to start an argument, but I'd like to hear what people think. How much is on LeBeau's play calling and how much is on poor play? I'm not ready to throw Dick under yet. Convince me why I should be by explaining to me why it's mostly his schemes and not his players playing sub par football.

[STOB Profile]

I admit I too have been "critical", however, has anyone considered maybe our defense is struggling because the offense isn't grinding it out anymore and very often just going 3 and out. That puts them on the field alot more. Consider our break downs usually happen in the 4th quarter. In the past we always controlled the clock so they were on the field ALOT less and stayed fresh. Now by the 4th they are exhusted and break down more.

[Jeemie Profile]

I admit I too have been "critical", however, has anyone considered maybe our defense is struggling because the offense isn't grinding it out anymore and very often just going 3 and out. That puts them on the field alot more. Consider our break downs usually happen in the 4th quarter. In the past we always controlled the clock so they were on the field ALOT less and stayed fresh. Now by the 4th they are exhusted and break down more.

Steelers held the ball for 35 minutes yesterday.

They're 4th in the NFL in TOP, currently.

In most of their high TOP games, they've passed much more than they've run. Only when they try and assuage the yinzer masses by running just for the sake of running do they go three and out.

I want the Steelers to run smarter...not more...that's my main beef with Arians (that, and he doesn't adjust when what he originally plans gets stopped).

But the Steelers as currently constituted cannot "grind it out".

And the TOP/3rd down statistics show they should quit trying to.

Finally, with about 33-35 minutes TOP, isn't that enough rest for the defense? How much should we possess the ball? 40 minutes? 45? 50?

[Steelhope Profile]

I think its mostly execution...lack of.

Also....without Troy we seem to lack heart or spark or smarts or SOMETHING!

Also....Harrison is being held almost EVERY F-ING PLAY

The only thing the "prevent" defense prevents is us holding the lead

[STOB Profile]

I think its mostly execution...lack of.

Also....without Troy we seem to lack heart or spark or smarts or SOMETHING!

Also....Harrison is being held almost EVERY F-ING PLAY

The only thing the "prevent" defense prevents is us holding the lead

Ok, but #1 defense to we suck over losing ONE player? There HAS to be more than ONE player being hurt. Unless last year was more of an illusion.

[Still CA Still Profile]

I agree that it's not all LeBeau although some of his calls are head-scratchers. Face it; we have an old defensive front and old linebackers in Farrior and James H. (although Harrison can still play; he is getting up there). We do not have a shut-down corner and other than Troy, our safety play is horrible. We have done very little in free agency or the draft to address these deficiencies and are now paying the price.
IMHO, I would love to see a return to the 4-3 but such blasphemy is not tolerated on this board.

[m1k3 Profile]

I think its mostly execution...lack of.

Also....without Troy we seem to lack heart or spark or smarts or SOMETHING!

Also....Harrison is being held almost EVERY F-ING PLAY

The only thing the "prevent" defense prevents is us holding the lead

Ok, but #1 defense to we suck over losing ONE player? There HAS to be more than ONE player being hurt. Unless last year was more of an illusion.

Don't forget about Aaron Smith.

He's one of the finest to ever don the black n gold.

[High5 Profile]

Yes not having A. Smith and Troy is huge. Smith does alot more then people realize. Im not gonna throw Lebeau under the bus but he certainly deserves a good amount of the blame with this defensive breakdown. Our blitzing schemes are obvioulsy not the same without Troy. And as bad as the secondary is I think he's gunshy with blitzing too much. He let off the throttle against the geek Rodgers last week. I didn't like his cockiness when he ran that TD in. I was so hoping they would have really started to bring the heat after that but never happened. Lebeau was skird.

[m1k3 Profile]

Yes not having A. Smith and Troy is huge. Smith does alot more then people realize. Im not gonna throw Lebeau under the bus but he certainly deserves a good amount of the blame with this defensive breakdown. Our blitzing schemes are obvioulsy not the same without Troy. And as bad as the secondary is I think he's gunshy with blitzing too much. He let off the throttle against the geek Rodgers last week. I didn't like his cockiness when he ran that TD in. I was so hoping they would have really started to bring the heat after that but never happened. Lebeau was skird.

Add McFadden to that list.

We also have a -5 turnover ratio this year.

[Fire Arians Profile]

I think its mostly execution...lack of.

Also....without Troy we seem to lack heart or spark or smarts or SOMETHING!

Also....Harrison is being held almost EVERY F-ING PLAY

The only thing the "prevent" defense prevents is us holding the lead

Ok, but #1 defense to we suck over losing ONE player? There HAS to be more than ONE player being hurt. Unless last year was more of an illusion.

troy does make that much of a difference. if you think about it, our safety play is weak with carter and clark. it becomes great if you replace either with troy. the only time the defense really looked good at all this year was when troy was in the lineup, opposing qb's have to watch out for him or pay the price. carter & clark are no threat to close in and intercept poorly thrown passes

[Coke Oven Profile]

I think that it's fallacious to try to separate the execution of the players from the coaching. The only way that it would be remotely valid to do so would be if LeBeau had absolutely no say so as to who his players were and which ones were allowed to play. Can you imagine guys, any guys, playing for someone like Lombardi and failing to execute?

[StillDodger Profile]

With DBs that cannot stop a marshmallow, how much of a difference would a different DC make? I think not as much as a lot of us want to think.

I totally agree that Bruce Arians and the ST coaches should have been canned yesterday, but I'm not yet convinced that LeBeau is the problem on the defensive side.

[r1stillerman Profile]

Amidst all the sniping at LeBeau, something seems to me to be missing in the discussion: how much of the defnesive collapse is on LeBeau's play calling and scheming and how much of it is on piss poor execution by the players? It's fine if Still Mill wants to keep giving LeBeau poor marks, lord knows Mill knows way, WAY more about football than I do, but when Mill continually ALSO gives various defensive players low marks, this needs raise the question of how much of this shit is really on LeBeau and how much is on piss poor play. I understand complaining about softee defensive schemes and the dreaded puss-like prevent, but why does Pitt's pass rush suck so bad? What the hell happened to Harrison and Woodley? Is LeBeau telling the D line and line backers to take it easy? Give me a break. And even on softee d back schemes, is LeBeau telling the d backs to take horrible angles, drop what should be interceptions, tackle without arms and flail around in no man's land (anyone else missing McFadden?)? I call BS. No way Dick got this retarded in just one off season. The defense just flat out overwhelmed opponents last year. Number one against the pass I recall. This is not an invite to start an argument, but I'd like to hear what people think. How much is on LeBeau's play calling and how much is on poor play? I'm not ready to throw Dick under yet. Convince me why I should be by explaining to me why it's mostly his schemes and not his players playing sub par football.

I agree I really thought that Gay was going to emerge as a very viable corner but what we got was three legged dog (no offense to three legged dogs). In addition Ike Taylor seems to have taken the year off. I know he was never big on interceptions but he was very strong in pass coverage that has clearly vanished this year. Clearly without Troy the defensive secondary collectively is a hapless bunch and in the fact that two players Gay and Taylor are not doing their job, then this spells disaster. I thing not being able to cover a receiver has put undue pressure on the rest of the defense. If receivers are covered then the line and linebackers make plays.

[High5 Profile]

Yes not having A. Smith and Troy is huge. Smith does alot more then people realize. Im not gonna throw Lebeau under the bus but he certainly deserves a good amount of the blame with this defensive breakdown. Our blitzing schemes are obvioulsy not the same without Troy. And as bad as the secondary is I think he's gunshy with blitzing too much. He let off the throttle against the geek Rodgers last week. I didn't like his cockiness when he ran that TD in. I was so hoping they would have really started to bring the heat after that but never happened. Lebeau was skird.

Add McFadden to that list.

We also have a -5 turnover ratio this year.

We never should have let Mcfadden go....its hard to believe we have 0 int from the corners this year.. none I know Mcfadden was a safety though right, not a corner?

[steelwest Profile]

It seems that offenses in general are far more dominant this year than last year. Thus, every defense is struggling this year. Teams like the Colts, Saints, Eagles, Chargers, etc. that are pass first teams with draw-style running games and defenses built around rushing the passer generally are the teams that are succeeding. The teams that are more blueprints for how the Steelers usually want to play -- Titans, Ravens, Giants -- have all had to remake themselves this year because their defenses cannot stop anyone good either. Remember Pats 59-0 over Titans? Have you seen the Giants defense in various games? The Ravens lost repeated games in the middle of the year because their defense could not make plays. Lastly, how did that Packers D look last weeek? Where are they ranked this year in defense?

The main conceptual problem the Steelers seem to have had this year is adjusting to the fact that no defense seems to be able to stop other offenses with any consistency at the end of games. And if they do it, it is because they got to the QB.

The philisophical problem we seem to have without Troy is the defense and Lebeau know we cannot stop anyone so they favor a bend but don't break scheme that allows yardage but takes time and hopes for offensive inefficiency. The only other option would be the repeated blitz and take our chances scheme. I imagine the thought process is our secondary without Troy is so bad that it makes no sense to blitz time and again because too many easy TDs will result.

Ordinarily this makes sense but I think at the end of games we might want to take a shot at mad blitzing. It is no different than trying a late onside kick. You take your shot and hope for the best. Otherwise, as Tomlin says, we seem to be lacking playmakers and therefore (like many other defenses) are struggling.

[StillLifer Profile]

We may have lesser execution on D due to key injuries (Polamalu, Smith), which exposes deficiencies that have BEEN there, but isn't it a coach's job to address these issues as they arise? PUT SOMEONE ELSE IN!!! Change it up a bit! We've been losing all year by giving up leads. We can't afford to do the same thing we've been doing and hope that it works out differently.

Every corner and safety should be playing as if his job depended upon it. Where the heck is the fire?

If someone is a great coach (which is who many believe LeBeau to be), they should be able to succeed to a degree with the personnel they have. They either adapt a scheme to their current squad or they inspire their players to achieve more. Sure, a good coach may ultimately be limited by talent but I haven't seen that he's actually tried other personnel options at this point. Put in a freaking rookie- we have nothing to lose at this point.

Yeah, our D needs some staff changes- but our DC can't believe his own hype and just chalk this up to an off year he can do nothing about. Coach, for crying out loud!!!