View topic - The official "Bench Willie and Start Me'Mo" Thread.

[WoodsonOfSteel Profile]

Fast Willie Parker = Speed, speed, speed.

Me'Mo = Not as fast but has an edge on FWP with everything else. Blocking, Vision/Hitting Holes Hard (Insert Hi5 joke here), Hands out of the backfield.

I believe some of this.

Do you?

Discuss.

[El Nino Profile]

I like parker, but I'm also on the ship of saying moore should start. Analyzing the two rb's:

speed - parker. no brainer

vision - moore. this is where parker drives me nuts, he seems to charge blindly at the hole the play is designed to hit, and is usually dropped for a loss or no gain if the blocking isn't perfect. moore is much better at seeing the creases in the d-line and attacking it.

blocking - moore by a long shot. He's been playing well at picking up blitzers, while I can't remember the last time willie has done this consistently. I do remember the time ben roeth got totally blasted by bart scott coming untouched off the side and willie didn't even see him coming when he was assigned to stay back and protect. Not saying either back could take on bart scott and win in a 1on1 situation, but at least getting in the way of him would prevent a full-speed collision into our quarterback and getting him killed

receiving - moore. no brainer. parker has 1 reception the entire year. last game ben was under pressure from a blitz while willie was out on a route, he wasn't even looking for the ball when he had it thrown his way. Isn't it the rb's responsibility to recognize a blitz is coming and expect the quick dump off? not willie. I don't see moore making this mistake.

Big plays - moore. moore has 6 total TD's, compared to parker's 4. parker has only 2 runs of 20+ yards this entire season compared to moore's 4. Moore also has 3 20+ yard gains from receptions. Moore also has 47 first downs (32 rushing, 15 receiving plays) compared to 23 for parker.

All in all, willie has been great for us in the past years, mainly because our run blocking has been great. This year is a different story, and his lack of vision makes him ineffective if holes aren't blown wide open for him. With the personnel on the o-line we have right now, Moore is the better choice.

[No l Gravity l Profile]

Against a bad defense? (esp. Bengals or Browns)

1. Parker
2. Moore
3. Russell

Against a good defense?

1. Moore
2. Russell
3. Mendenhall
4. Carey Davis
5. Ben Roethlisberger
6. Paul Ernster
8. Bruce Arians
9. Dookie
10-54. insert player
55. Parker

[zapunto Profile]

I'll take it a step further -- MeMo and Mendenhall next year, move or cut Fast Willie. This team needs a plodder much more than it needs the occassional home run hitter.

-c-

[Hagerstown Steelman Profile]

I think all need to take a deep breath before putting FWP out to pasture.

Remember he was leading the league in rushing last year before the broken leg and showed no ill effects this year until the knee injury. I am sure Parker is still feeling the effects of the knee injury which I assume hurts his ability to cut back. Plus our O-line is decent but not what it was the past couple of years.

If all are healthy I like the combo of Parker, Moore, Mendenhall. Gives a three headed monster like the Giants have.

In my opinion we keep Willie since if nothing else Mendenhall has the tools but is still an unproven comodity.

[Hoppy Profile]

Don't leave out Tom "the bomb" Tracy!

[isfry Profile]

I wouldn't mind seeing Moore start. If Tomlin is set on their splitting time, I think Moore might do more damage tiring them out in the first half or so, as he seems to bring a double threat. Then in the second half, maybe FWP is gonna have bigger holes and better lanes. Just a thought.

[No l Gravity l Profile]

I think all need to take a deep breath before putting FWP out to pasture.

Remember he was leading the league in rushing last year before the broken leg and showed no ill effects this year until the knee injury. I am sure Parker is still feeling the effects of the knee injury which I assume hurts his ability to cut back. Plus our O-line is decent but not what it was the past couple of years.

If all are healthy I like the combo of Parker, Moore, Mendenhall. Gives a three headed monster like the Giants have.

In my opinion we keep Willie since if nothing else Mendenhall has the tools but is still an unproven comodity.

That argument is stated over and over again. You do realize despite "leading the league in rushing before his injury" he was pretty average in terms of running the ball. This leading the league crap is almost as bad as Gardocki never having a punt blocked. I'm almost 100% sure he lead the league in no to negative yard gains as well.

[Hagerstown Steelman Profile]

Gravity,

Last year was a dissappointment for FWP. Especially since he only had a few TD's.

However, how much of that was line play and Arians? Parker did have a lot of negative carries but many were jail breaks. I don't think the Steelers have adapted to FWP's style. He can get a tough yard.

However, they rarely run the quick pitch, screens, etc to get FWP to the edge. If Willie gets a seam he can get more tough yards than most people think.

I don't put him as a top 5 back in the NFL. However, I am glad he is on our team. Plus the injury bug this year has hurt his production.

Good comments.

[toomuchmerrilhoge Profile]

I stand by FWP. The problem, in my opinion, is that he is over-coached. He was most effective when he first came into the league (granted the O-line was better at that time) and seemed to be running more instinctively. It seems now that he wants to prove that he can be a tough back who can run inside (aka replace the Bus), when his strength is getting out in space and making cuts. Mewelde, however, has amazing smarts and it seems he can read what the defense is trying to do on the fly. I for one, wish they would just let Fast Willie be Fast Willie.

[El Nino Profile]

I stand by FWP. The problem, in my opinion, is that he is over-coached. He was most effective when he first came into the league (granted the O-line was better at that time) and seemed to be running more instinctively. It seems now that he wants to prove that he can be a tough back who can run inside (aka replace the Bus), when his strength is getting out in space and making cuts. Mewelde, however, has amazing smarts and it seems he can read what the defense is trying to do on the fly. I for one, wish they would just let Fast Willie be Fast Willie.

exactly what i think of fwp. he's not running like willie parker, he's running like he's trying to be jerome bettis jr. he doesn't have the frame for that kind of running and it's probably the reason why he's getting injured so much.

[Leo Profile]

I like FWP, and he gets permanent props for the 75 yard dash in SB 40, BUT zapunto has a very good point. Even uninjured, Wille has (had) way too many -1 or 0 yard runs.

[WoodsonOfSteel Profile]

Time to revitalize this thread.

[El Nino Profile]

moore needs to start already. ever notice how the offense moves the ball with him in there, then sputters everytime we put parker back in? i'm willing to bet he's been stopped for negative yardage more times than ben's been sacked this year. negative running plays are drive killers, and willie has a lot of those.

against dallas there was a drive where we were moving the ball well, with moore picking up good 4-5 yard runs with some good receptions + YAC. then for some reason we put parker back in when we're in scoring range, then he runs for no gain and then negative yardage which pretty much is the beginning of the end of what could have been a nice drive.

to my list of what moore does that parker doesn't, it's break tackles. parker 90% of the time goes down after 1st contact, and it's usually the first defender that gets there. moore is much more effective at shrugging off a tackle or evading would-be defenders, and is much more consistent at winning the 1on1's in the open field. he's just better than parker at everything except the 40 yard dash

i like the job tomlin has been doing so far, but I wish he'd freakin bench parker. he isn't producing and moore is.

[Jeemie Profile]

Moore does his most effective running when we're in passing formations.

If you think the Steelers should pass 40-50 times a game, then Moore is your man.

Otherwise, we need to go with Willie.

I will agree, however, that Moore needs more touches than he's been getting the last couple of weeks. As does Russell.

[RoethlisCrosby87 Profile]

It seems like it has always been feast or famine with FWP, which I have never liked. I'd rather have a guy who we can consistently count on week in and week out to pound out some positive yardage. It seems like people always refer to FWP as a home run threat, but he really doesn't hit home runs anymore. He had a great game against a bad Houston team in week 1 which gave us all a false hope. Other than that, he has been pretty terrible this year.

I'm aware that he was leading the league in rushing before his injury last year, but he has been feast or famine for a while. For example in 2007.. he follows up big games against BUF and SF with a 1.9 avg for 37 yards @ ARI. In 2006, he had big games against NO and CLE that masked his 1.8 avg against JAX and 2.4 avg against ATL. It's hard to expect him to run against Baltimore, so I don't hold those games against him. I'm just saying, this year, he hasn't even had the occasional big game to make up for his bad games... they've all been pretty forgettable. For people who call him a home run hitter, he hasn't really hit one since the super bowl. He had two big runs against New Orleans in 2006 that he got chased down on!

Let's hope Mendenhall is a banger who can get yards after contact. I liked what I saw from him early in the year. For the rest of this year, I say give MeMo and Russell more carries and see what they are made of. MeMo is not necessarily the answer but he is running better than FWP this year without a doubt.

[Hagerstown Steelman Profile]

Why not put Parker and Moore in the same back field? Two options for screen passes and bodies to pick up a blitz. You could sweep to either side of the formation, open up play action.

I guess this would be too radical of a move for Arians. First of all, it would make sense and. Secondly it might work. what fun is it unless Willie, Ben, or someone on the offense is not getting squashed.

[El Nino Profile]

Moore does his most effective running when we're in passing formations.

If you think the Steelers should pass 40-50 times a game, then Moore is your man.

Otherwise, we need to go with Willie.

I will agree, however, that Moore needs more touches than he's been getting the last couple of weeks. As does Russell.

I suppose that's better than parker, who can't do any effective running regardless of what the formation is. Willie should be our #3 rb behind Moore and Russell. If we're really intent on a power running game, perhaps gary should get more play time. He's the hardest runner out of the backs we currently have. Of course I'd take willie over najeh 'big for nothing' davenport, but that's like saying a puke smells a little better than a steaming pile of shit

Yesterday, moore ran the ball from the same formations and a couple times, the same play that parker's number was called. The difference was parker can't beat anyone. First defender to him always takes him down. Moore was gaining yards because he's actually capable of winning the 1on1 battles, which parker cannot. Parker is a guy that needs a dominant line and a fullback, because he's easier to knock over than a card house, and despite his overrated speed, can't make anyone miss. I wouldn't even say he's an average RB, because I'd take over half of the starting NFL rb's over this guy. Even in his best years, he's done dick against any decent defense. Stats are a little misleading when you run for 150+ yards against the bengals and browns twice a year

[zapunto Profile]

Pulled straight from Rotoworld.com:

Willie Parker has only two runs of more than 20 yards this season, tying him with Justin Fargas and (amazingly) Maurice Drew for third fewest among ball carriers with 500 yards. Only Willis McGahee (1) and LeRon McClain (1) have less.

Haha, both the Ravens' runs came against Dallas, that's funny, but I digress. If you're counting, MeMo has four in 30 less carries.

[toomuchmerrilhoge Profile]

Why not put Parker and Moore in the same back field? Two options for screen passes and bodies to pick up a blitz. You could sweep to either side of the formation, open up play action.

Yes! I've always wondered why we can't use more of a two-halfback backfield. Is there some law imposed on Arians/Tomlin to prevent them from doing this? I was hopeful at the beginning of the year that we could see FWP/Mendenhall together in the backfield, which gives great flexibility as far as screen plays, blocking schemes, play-action, and pass/run blocking. Christ, anyone who ever played Super Tecmo Bowl remembers the Marcus Allen/Bo Jackson backfield....very hard to defend! But in all seriousness, it seems ludicrous that we don't use this in our playbook.